Hi folks,
So currently running a westfeild with 2.0 black top zetec with nodiz and r1 bike carbs but want to find more power!
Don’t and haven’t got loads to spend on getting the more power so looking at trying a 1.8 head? St170 head? Someone on here must have a cheap way to get more power from a standard zetec engine, so come on folks what do you think will be the best way to get more power with just time to spend
Dicky
Need more power! All ideas please
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
One of these on the air intake?
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
depends what you want i guess.
so many options. Blower, charger or NA
i stuck with NA on the zetec blacktop and built a strong reliable engine that has a nice amount of power and a very flat torque curve.
i spent ages researching how to get the torque just right and what was needed and ended up sending the car off to engine builders and had a new intake system, head port matched, cams and a new exhaust system fitted.It got me to 205bhp with a limit at 7500 has a really nice torque band right across the rev range and is pretty much bomb proof to that limit. No problems and its been ragged all over europe. The car still pulls to the limiter so if i got stronger internals it would go to 215+ above this. think i spent about 7k in total.
i think what a lot of people forget about is the Torque, its so important in how the car feels.
for me if you havent already... invest in some good quality cams. Think about what you want from the engine in future as this will effect what you buy now. I had fast road cams fitted which give nice evemn torque across the range. You could fit rally cams which will give you an big increase in BHP but likely hood will be a pig to drive low down.
other option is homemade turbo power with bits from other cars. The stock plastic black top intake is good for enough boost to take you to 220 and i have actually got one in the garage because thats what i was going to do.
I know a guy who built his engine with really high NA HP in mind and spent a fortune. he wasnt happy with it at all because it didnt feel right mid range or low down, its hard to stay at max chat on our roads in the UK.
just bare in mind...
cheap power = not reliable
reliable power = not cheap
so many options. Blower, charger or NA
i stuck with NA on the zetec blacktop and built a strong reliable engine that has a nice amount of power and a very flat torque curve.
i spent ages researching how to get the torque just right and what was needed and ended up sending the car off to engine builders and had a new intake system, head port matched, cams and a new exhaust system fitted.It got me to 205bhp with a limit at 7500 has a really nice torque band right across the rev range and is pretty much bomb proof to that limit. No problems and its been ragged all over europe. The car still pulls to the limiter so if i got stronger internals it would go to 215+ above this. think i spent about 7k in total.
i think what a lot of people forget about is the Torque, its so important in how the car feels.
for me if you havent already... invest in some good quality cams. Think about what you want from the engine in future as this will effect what you buy now. I had fast road cams fitted which give nice evemn torque across the range. You could fit rally cams which will give you an big increase in BHP but likely hood will be a pig to drive low down.
other option is homemade turbo power with bits from other cars. The stock plastic black top intake is good for enough boost to take you to 220 and i have actually got one in the garage because thats what i was going to do.
I know a guy who built his engine with really high NA HP in mind and spent a fortune. he wasnt happy with it at all because it didnt feel right mid range or low down, its hard to stay at max chat on our roads in the UK.
just bare in mind...
cheap power = not reliable
reliable power = not cheap
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
or you could just take as much weight off the car (and yourself) as possible...
my car gets quicker when im in the alps cos i dont eat and i get lighter....
my car gets quicker when im in the alps cos i dont eat and i get lighter....
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
Yer thanks Matt! Twat I was thinking 1.8 black too head as they have the same size valves but if Iam right a smaller combustion chamber, higher compression more power, 7k this is going to be a cheap power increase finding short cuts not spending loads of cash, cos I ant got it!
The st170 head has same size valves and a larger port size not sure about combustion chamber yet as not got one to hand to check
The st170 head has same size valves and a larger port size not sure about combustion chamber yet as not got one to hand to check
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
first thing i'd do Dicky is to take it to a rolling road (a decent one and one that you can then repeatedly use) and see what its got, in terms of peak power, where the band is and what the torque is- and how that's spread.
Without a baseline whatever you do will be subjective...you might find that right now its way off where it should be....i think that the consensus is that a decent standard 2.0 is likely to give circa 170/175 tops on an accurate r/road. If it's a mile away from that then your answer might be as simple as the fact that the current engine is knackered, or that the rev limit is too low or....
None of the upgrades are going to be cheap unless you're extremely lucky in picking up bits n bobs.
new cams are £500 & a remap without fitting them......
exhaust makes a big difference but a new system (custom) will set you back £12-1500.
headwork - keeping standard valves if you get it done by a 'pro' at the cheap end will be £5-600 + remap.
As for swapping heads, the st170 is (i believe) a fable and a sod to tune compared to a silvertop/blacktop. They never had 170 which one would have assumed they would when they were in the donor, and whilst freeing up the exhaust etc will give more power in a kit, i think that a full st170 with just the cam delete or a progression built into the map will only be 170/180...you'd need cams in that to get it to 200.
With luck and a following wind and if you do the undoing/putting back, you could do cams & head for about 1000/1200 a remap would prob be £250 cheap end, and say an initial power run before at 100. Keeping the rev limit to 7000 or so i think ( i stand to be corrected) is ok without ARP bolts(?) and that should give you around 200.
Cheaper solution to make it feel 'peppy' would be to stick on a proper lightweight flywheel/clutch and pulley, and make sure that it's got a 3.92 diff.
Without a baseline whatever you do will be subjective...you might find that right now its way off where it should be....i think that the consensus is that a decent standard 2.0 is likely to give circa 170/175 tops on an accurate r/road. If it's a mile away from that then your answer might be as simple as the fact that the current engine is knackered, or that the rev limit is too low or....
None of the upgrades are going to be cheap unless you're extremely lucky in picking up bits n bobs.
new cams are £500 & a remap without fitting them......
exhaust makes a big difference but a new system (custom) will set you back £12-1500.
headwork - keeping standard valves if you get it done by a 'pro' at the cheap end will be £5-600 + remap.
As for swapping heads, the st170 is (i believe) a fable and a sod to tune compared to a silvertop/blacktop. They never had 170 which one would have assumed they would when they were in the donor, and whilst freeing up the exhaust etc will give more power in a kit, i think that a full st170 with just the cam delete or a progression built into the map will only be 170/180...you'd need cams in that to get it to 200.
With luck and a following wind and if you do the undoing/putting back, you could do cams & head for about 1000/1200 a remap would prob be £250 cheap end, and say an initial power run before at 100. Keeping the rev limit to 7000 or so i think ( i stand to be corrected) is ok without ARP bolts(?) and that should give you around 200.
Cheaper solution to make it feel 'peppy' would be to stick on a proper lightweight flywheel/clutch and pulley, and make sure that it's got a 3.92 diff.
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
ST head has bigger valves and better ports but you can get a standard head to flow very well if you work it.
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
Rather than chase power, which will cost £££'s, have you maxed the weight saving possibilities?
Many are free - Rip out all the carpets, passenger seat if you don't take pax, screen & wipers, heater, can get a light-weight battery quite cheap.
Many are free - Rip out all the carpets, passenger seat if you don't take pax, screen & wipers, heater, can get a light-weight battery quite cheap.
Westfield Zetec turbo & Westfield Megabusa turbo
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
Done the weight reduction bits, no screen no heater no carpets and light weight battery, sounding like the only way is to spend big money to get more power
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Re: Need more power! All ideas please
Drive a Citroen C1 for 6 months and you'll find your Seven much quicker
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